Developing the Leader Within You by John C. Maxwell

In this insightful episode of the Mind Set in Stone Podcast, Dave and Poppy dive into the transformative principles outlined in John C. Maxwell's classic, Developing the Leader Within You. This book offers a blueprint for unlocking your leadership potential, whether you’re leading a team, a business, or yourself. 

Together, the hosts unpack Maxwell's timeless concepts of vision, influence, prioritisation, and personal growth, providing actionable steps for listeners to become the leaders they aspire to be.

Perfect for aspiring leaders or anyone looking to make a greater impact, this episode delivers practical wisdom and motivation to help you lead with purpose and authenticity. 

Tune in and discover how to develop the leader within you!

Thank you for tuning in to this episode of Mind Set in Stone Podcasts. If you enjoyed our deep dive, be sure to subscribe and leave us a review! Share your thoughts with us on social media, and let us know which book you’d like us to explore next. Until next time, keep your mind set in stone and your curiosity open.

This has been a Big L Riz Media Podcast—where big ideas meet lasting impressions.

Transcript

Welcome to Mind Set in Stone Podcasts, where we dive deep into the most compelling books on the shelf. Join hosts Dave and Poppy as they uncover the stories, themes, and ideas that shape our understanding and inspire curiosity. Get ready to explore the big ideas that leave a lasting impact.

Let's get started.

All right everyone, get ready for another deep dive. Today we're tackling leadership, and our trusty guides are John C. Maxwell's books, Developing the Leader Within You, the original and the updated 2.0 version.

Two for the price of one.

Right. Now, what I really find fascinating about Maxwell's work is this idea that leadership isn't about having a fancy title or being the boss, it's about influence. You know what?

That means every single one of us, no matter where we are in life, we've all got leadership potential.

He really flips the script on that traditional view, doesn't he?

He does, and that's what we're going to back today. We'll be exploring some pretty intriguing questions like, did you know that there are actually levels of leadership? It's not a one-size-fits-all kind of thing.

Oh, yeah. Then there's that age-old question, what's the real difference between being a boss and actually being a leader? It's not always the same thing, right?

Definitely not.

Plus, we'll discover how prioritizing like you're on the sinking Titanic can make you a better leader.

Crazy, right?

Well, I'm hooked already. Let's dive in. I'm with you.

Let's start with the foundation. What exactly is leadership if it's not just about the job title?

Well, in a nutshell, Maxwell nails it when he says it's all about influence, not position. He's really pushing the idea that true leadership is about attracting followers, not just having people who have to listen to you because of your title.

Right. It's that difference between having to and wanting to that really changes the game.

To drive this point home, he even uses a powerful quote from James C. George's, leadership is the ability to obtain followers. So, it's about earning that authority, not just assuming you have it because of your rank.

It makes me think of this story about General Pershing, the General Pershing World War I. Apparently, he was giving a speech at West Point.

Yeah.

He said, gentlemen, he said, you will never be great leaders until you can put yourself in the place of the man under you.

Wow.

Like even back then, these great military minds understood that real authority comes from respect, not just rank.

It's timeless wisdom.

Totally. And the cool thing is when we shift our focus to influence instead of position, it empowers all of us to lead, no matter what our current role is.

Absolutely. We don't have to wait for a promotion or a fancy title to start making a difference.

Exactly. Now, Maxwell doesn't stop there. He takes this whole leadership thing a step further by introducing his concept of the five levels of leadership.

Oh, the levels.

Yeah, the levels. He's saying leadership is a journey, and we progress through these levels as we grow and develop.

It makes sense when you think about it.

It does. Lay it on us. What are these levels and how do we figure out where we stand?

The first level is position. This is the most basic level and it's where a lot of people start. It's basically leading based solely on your job title.

You're the boss, people have to listen to you.

Exactly. You might have people reporting to you, but that doesn't automatically make you a leader in their eyes.

It's like you're wearing the uniform, but you haven't quite earned the respect that comes with being a true leader.

Right. It's like having the title, but not necessarily the skills or the heart of a leader.

Makes sense. How do we level up? How do we move beyond just being the boss to actually being a leader?

That's where level two comes in permission. This is where things start to get interesting because at this level, you're moving beyond just your title and starting to build real relationships with the people you're leading.

It's about connecting with people on a human level.

Exactly. People start choosing to follow you because they like and respect you, not just because they have to.

Trust and rapport becomes super important here.

Absolutely.

It reminds me of when I joined that volunteer group a while back. There was this one person who wasn't officially in charge, but everyone just naturally gravitated towards their ideas because they were so good at connecting with people. They had this natural leadership quality that drew people in.

I love that example. That's the essence of permission leadership.

So, we've got position, permission. What's next?

All right. Level three is production. At this level, it's all about results.

People follow you because you're getting things done and you're achieving goals.

So, you're walking the talk, proving yourself as a capable leader.

Exactly. Your competence shines through at this level.

But I'm sensing there's more to it than just checking boxes and meeting deadlines, right?

You got it. This is actually where things can get a little tricky. Maxwell warns against stepping levels, like jumping straight to production, without first building that foundation of permission.

I see.

Because if you do that, your leadership can be unstable.

It's like building a house on sand. It might look impressive at first, but it won't last.

Perfect analogy.

So, what's the secret sauce? How do we build that solid foundation and avoid the whole house on sand situation?

Well, that brings us to the next two levels. Level four is people development. This is where you shift from focusing solely on tasks to actually investing in the people you're leading.

Ooh, this is where things start to get really exciting. It's about empowering others to become leaders themselves.

Exactly. You start mentoring others, helping them grow and develop their own leadership potential.

It's like instead of just trying to do everything yourself, you're creating a ripple effect of leadership. It's multiplying your impact exponentially.

You got it. And that leads to the final level, the peak of the Mountain Tinnacle. This is where you're not just leading a team, you're creating a legacy.

Wow, that's powerful.

You're developing other leaders who will go on to develop even more leaders, and it just keeps going.

It's like planting a seed that grows into a whole forest.

Exactly. You're leaving a lasting impact on the world that extends far beyond your immediate circle.

Okay, so we've got these five levels, but let's get real for a moment. Let's say someone's listening to this and they're like, okay, I'm stuck at position level. I feel like I'm just going through the motions.

What's one tangible thing I can do to start moving towards that permission level?

Great question. One of the most powerful things you can do is to simply focus on building genuine connections with the people you work with.

So simple, yet so profound.

Right. Make an effort to get to know them beyond just their job titles, understand their motivations, show genuine interest in their well-being, treat them like human beings, not just cogs in a machine.

So instead of barking orders, take the time to connect on a human level, build rapport and trust.

Absolutely. It's a shift in mindset really, from managing people to leading them.

It's a journey, right? We're not going to master all five levels overnight.

Definitely not. Be patient with yourself, embrace the process of growth, and remember that even small steps can lead to significant progress over time.

Love that. This is all so insightful, but we're just getting started. Next, we're going to unpack some of the practical strategies that Maxwell outlines for developing those effective leadership habits, like his fascinating take on prioritization.

It involves a pretty wild anecdote about the Titanic.

Yeah, I remember that one. Can't wait to hear your take on it.

Buckle up. It's a good one.

I think it's interesting how Maxwell emphasizes a positive attitude as being absolutely crucial for effective leadership.

Yeah. It's easy to brush off attitude as something fluffy, not that important in the grand scheme of things.

Right.

But Maxwell is saying it's a core element, like right up there with the big stuff.

He really is. He even says it's more important than talent or even skill. Think about that for a second.

He's basically saying that a positive attitude is like the lens we view everything through. It shapes how we act, how we react, and it definitely rubs off on the people around us.

Yeah. No, I totally get that. I've definitely worked with people who are brilliant at what they do, super talented, but they have this negative energy that just brings everyone down.

It's like their negativity is contagious.

It's like a dark cloud hanging over everything.

Exactly. It makes it so hard to get anything done when everyone's feeling dragged down like that.

Maxwell actually quotes Charles Swindle on this. He says, the longer I live, the more I realize the impact of attitude on life. Attitude to me is more important than facts.

It is more important than the past, than education, than money, than circumstances, than failures, than successes, than what other people think or say or do.

Wow, that's a mouthful.

It is.

But it really hits home. It's like, yeah, stuff happens, life throws curveballs, but it's how we choose to react, how we choose to view those situations.

That's where the power lies.

It's about choosing to approach things with a positive, proactive mindset, even when it's tough.

And choosing is the key word here. Maxwell is really clear that maintaining that positive attitude is a conscious choice, a discipline you got to work at.

Right, it's not about ignoring the challenges or pretending everything's perfect. No. It's about choosing to focus on the good, on the possibilities, even when things are tough.

It's about being intentional with our outlook.

I've heard that saying life is 10 percent what happens to you and 90 percent how you react to it.

Oh, that's a good one.

It's like we can't always control what life throws at us.

Right.

But we can control how we respond to it.

And to show how powerful this can be, Maxwell brings up the story of Roger Bannister, the first guy to break the four-minute mile.

Oh, yeah. Legendary.

Right. For years, people thought it was physically impossible for a human to run that fast. But Bannister proved them wrong.

It wasn't that he was physically superior to everyone else.

Nope, not at all. What held people back was their belief that it couldn't be done.

It was a mental barrier.

Exactly. And Bannister shattered that barrier. And then suddenly more and more runners started breaking the four-minute mile.

It's like once he proved it was possible, everyone else started believing it too.

And Maxwell challenges us to do the same thing in our own lives, to identify and challenge those limiting beliefs that are holding us back.

So, it's not about being delusional or ignoring reality.

No, not at all.

It's about recognizing that sometimes the biggest obstacles we face are the ones we create in our own minds.

And it's about shifting from a mindset of scarcity to a mindset of abundance, believing in our potential and embracing those possibilities.

So, like instead of saying, I can't do this, we start asking ourselves, what if I could?

Exactly. And that simple shift in perspective can open up a whole new world of possibilities.

Okay, yeah. I'm starting to see how powerful this attitude thing really is. But I'm also thinking about how change is a constant in life.

And change can be tough, right? It can bring up a lot of resistance and discomfort.

Oh, for sure.

So how do we navigate that effectively, especially as leaders?

Well, Maxwell is really good at breaking down complex ideas into practical steps. And he does the same thing with leading change. He says people don't resist change itself, they resist being changed.

That's a subtle but important distinction.

It is. And then he gives us this awesome framework called Plan Ahead to help us lead change effectively.

Okay. I love a good acronym. Walk me through it.

How do we plan ahead for successful change?

Okay. So, the first step is P, predetermine the change. It's about being proactive, like what needs to change?

Why does it need to change? Not just reacting when a crisis hits, but looking ahead and planning for a better future.

Got it. So, we have a vision, like we were just talking about. Yes.

We know where we want to go. Yes. And why it's important to get there.

And then L, lay out your steps. This is where you get specific. Okay.

What actions need to be taken? What's the timeline? Who's responsible for what?

Create a roadmap, you know, so everyone knows where they're going and how to get there.

Okay. So, breaking down the big scary change into smaller, more manageable steps.

Exactly. Then A, adjust priorities. Change often requires us to shift our focus, so you got to let go of some things to make space for the new stuff.

Focusing on that 20 percent, that will have the biggest impact on the change we're going for.

Right. What's next?

And notify key people. Change can be unsettling, so communicate clearly and early with everyone who will be affected. No surprises.

Transparency and respect are key, right?

Absolutely. And then we move on to the Ahead part of the acronym.

Okay. Hit me with it.

A. Allow time for acceptance. Change doesn't happen overnight.

People need time to process, adjust, get on board.

Patience is a virtue for sure.

Especially when it comes to change. So don't rush it. Understand that people move at different paces.

What's the next day?

Head into action. You've laid the groundwork. Now it's time to start implementing those steps you outlined.

Time to make it happen.

Yeah.

But even with the best plans, there are going to be bumps along the way, right?

Oh, absolutely. And that's where expect problems comes in, the E. Things rarely go perfectly smoothly.

There will be unexpected challenges, setbacks, resistance.

So, it's not about trying to avoid problems altogether. It's about being prepared to deal with them when they inevitably pop up.

Exactly. Be flexible, be ready to adapt. And then the last day, always point to successes.

Even when things are tough, celebrate those wins no matter how small. It keeps the momentum going, boosts morale, reminds everyone why you're going through this whole change thing in the first place.

Love it. Keep your eyes on the prize.

Exactly. And finally, Dee, daily review your progress. Change is a process, not a one-time event, so you got to keep monitoring, making adjustments along the way.

Stay engaged, keep your finger on the pulse, make sure things are moving in the right direction.

Exactly. Maxwell really nails it with this plan ahead framework. He's showing us that leading change is all about thoughtful, intentional leadership.

Yeah, it's not something you just announce and then hope for the best.

Nope. You got to be in it for the long haul, guiding the process every step of the way.

This is giving me so much to think about. It's like a whole new way of approaching change, not as something to fear, but as an opportunity for growth and improvement.

That's the key takeaway, right? To see change as a chance to learn, adapt, and evolve.

We've talked about the five levels of leadership, prioritization, character, a positive attitude, navigating change. What else does Maxwell have in store for us on this deep dive into leadership?

Problem solving is a key leadership skill. Effective leaders, they're proactive problem solvers.

Okay. I'm intrigued. Problem solving, I mean, that's a part of life in general, right?

So, what makes it different when it comes to leadership?

He encourages us to be more than just problem spotters. It's easy to just point out what's wrong, complain about it, wait for someone else to fix it.

It's like that saying, if you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.

Exactly. Maxwell wants us to be actively involved in finding solutions. And he actually uses this pretty funny anecdote about an insurance claim.

This guy tried to blame his car accident on a deer.

Oh no.

Yeah, but get this, he said a deer was standing in the middle of the road meditating.

Wait, meditating? Okay, that's hilarious. But I guess it kind of illustrates how some people would rather avoid responsibility than actually try to find a solution.

Exactly. But good leaders, they don't shy away from problems. They lean in, ask the right questions, gather information, and work together with their team to find those solutions.

So proactive, not reactive. Instead of getting stuck in the blame game, it's about saying, okay, what can we do about this?

Exactly. And he even suggests specific questions to ask. Like, who knows the most about this problem?

And who needs to buy in for the solution to actually work?

Oh, that's smart. It's about leveraging the collective wisdom and experience of the team. You know, this makes me think of a time at my previous job, we had this major challenge and everyone was stressed, no one knew what to do.

But instead of pointing fingers or panicking, our leader, she brought us all together, asked for our input, and we had this awesome brainstorming session.

That's great.

It was amazing how by working together and sharing our different perspectives, we were able to come up with a solution that actually worked.

That's what Maxwell's talking about, collaborative problem solving in action.

And it wasn't just about finding the solution, it was about how it brought the team closer together.

Maxwell is a big believer in that. He says this approach not only leads to better solutions, but it also strengthens team unity and morale.

It makes sense. When people feel like they're part of the solution, they're more invested in the outcome.

Exactly. And this idea of investing in people, it really leads into another crucial aspect of leadership that Maxwell talks about, developing potential leaders.

Okay, I'm excited to talk about this one. I've had some amazing mentors in my life, and now I really want to pay it forward, help others develop their own leadership potential. But where do we even begin?

How do you spot those future leaders and nurture their growth?

Well, Maxwell says it starts with a shift in mindset. It's not about just delegating tasks, it's about truly investing in people, helping them discover their strengths and develop them. He uses this phrase, building a farm team of future leaders.

Okay, I love that analogy.

That's so visual, right?

Yeah, it's like you're cultivating a garden, providing the right conditions for growth, nurturing each plant to reach its full potential.

Exactly. He talks about looking for people with positiveness, a servant heart and a growth mindset. Those are like the essential ingredients for effective leadership.

So, you're not just looking for technical skills or experience, you're looking for those deeper qualities that make someone a natural leader. It's about seeing the potential in people and then giving them the support, the guidance, the opportunities to blossom.

You got it. Once you've got that team of talented individuals, the next challenge is creating a cohesive, high-performing team out of them.

That's where the dream team coach analogy comes in, right? Yeah. Maxwell talks about how great leaders are like coaches, guiding and supporting their teams to achieve amazing things.

Exactly. He says, a dream team coach has several key responsibilities. Choosing the right players, communicating the game plan clearly, fostering that team spirit, developing skills, preparing for problems and providing support.

It's like a whole leadership playbook.

Wow. It sounds like a lot to juggle. It's like being a strategist, a cheerleader, a mentor and a problem solver all rolled into one.

It's a demanding role for sure, but it's incredibly rewarding to see a team come together like that, to see them leverage their strengths and achieve something truly remarkable. It's like magic.

This all makes so much sense, but honestly, I'm feeling a little overwhelmed. Character, communication, problem solving, developing others, where do we even begin to put all this into practice? It's a lot.

I hear you. Maxwell acknowledges that the journey of leadership can feel like a lot sometimes. That's why he encourages us to shift our focus from being goal conscious to growth conscious.

Okay. I like that. What's the difference?

Goal conscious is all about reaching a specific destination, checking things off the list. Growth conscious is about the journey itself, the continuous process of learning, developing, expanding our capabilities.

So instead of asking, how long will it take me to get there? We're asking, how far can I go? It's about embracing the process of becoming a better leader rather than just focusing on the end result.

Exactly. It's about seeing growth as an ongoing adventure, not a finite destination. And that shift in mindset can make all the difference in how we approach those leadership challenges.

You know, this is really resonating with me. It's about letting go of that need to have all the answers, to be perfect, to achieve some arbitrary definition of success. It's about embracing the messiness and the uncertainty of the journey, knowing that it's in those moments of challenge and discomfort that we truly grow and evolve as leaders.

Beautifully said.

And that brings us to another powerful concept that Maxwell emphasizes. Self-discipline.

Ah, yes. The not so glamorous but absolutely essential ingredient for success in any area of life. Especially leadership.

He's not afraid to tell it like it is. He says straight up, if you only do what you want to do, you will never get to do what you really want to do.

That's a truth bomb.

It is. It's so easy to get sidetracked by instant gratification, to choose the path of least resistance. But real fulfillment, it comes from delaying gratification, putting in the work, staying committed to our goals, even when it's tough, even when it's not fun.

It's about having the grit and determination to keep going, even when we don't feel like it.

Exactly. Maxwell even uses this analogy of uphill climbing versus downhill sliding. He's saying that everything worthwhile in life requires effort.

You know, it requires us to climb uphill. But the rewards, they're so much greater than the fleeting pleasures of just coasting downhill.

So, it's about choosing the path of growth and challenge, even when it's uncomfortable, because that's where we truly expand our capabilities and become the best versions of ourselves.

And he has this great tip. He says, start with small victories, you know, but build momentum in areas where you're already strong, where you have passion.

So, find those things you're naturally good at and enjoy doing, and then develop the discipline to consistently show up and do the work, even when you don't feel like it.

Exactly. It's about building those positive habits that will compound into significant achievements over time.

It's like those small wins. They create a ripple effect, helping us overcome procrastination, build confidence, and stay motivated on that journey of leadership.

It's all connected.

This is all so insightful, but I'm realizing we've covered a lot of ground in this second part of our deep dive. We've gone from the power of a positive attitude to navigating change effectively, from problem-solving to developing potential leaders, and the importance of self-discipline. It's a lot.

It is. But we've really explored those core principles that Maxwell believes are essential for unlocking our leadership potential.

And in our final part, we're going to dive into some even more nuanced aspects of leadership, including the importance of vision, the art of teamwork, and how to create a lasting legacy.

Ooh, can't wait to unpack those with you.

Stay tuned, folks. This deep dive is just getting even deeper.

Alright, so as we wrap up our deep dive into John C. Maxwell's wisdom on leadership, there's one more piece of the puzzle we need to talk about, and that's vision.

Vision, yeah. I can definitely see how that ties into everything we've been discussing so far. Right.

Because if you don't have a clear sense of where you're going, it's kind of hard to prioritize, inspire others, or even navigate all those inevitable changes that come up.

You hit the nail on the head. Maxwell is a big believer in vision as the driving force behind leadership. It's like the thing that gives us direction, purpose, that keeps us motivated, especially when things get tough.

I like that, that driving force.

He even says that a leader without vision is like a ship without a rudder, just destined to drift aimlessly.

That's a powerful image. It makes total sense though.

Right.

If you don't know where you're going, how can you lead anyone else there? But where does that vision come from? Is it something we just make up, or is it something deeper, something that's already inside us?

Maxwell's take on this is super interesting. He says, true vision, it comes from within. It's not something you just impose on other people.

It's got to be something that emerges from your own values, beliefs, passions.

Ah, so it's like connecting with your own personal why.

Exactly, and when that vision is authentic, when it truly aligns with who you are at your core, it resonating with other people in a powerful way.

Because they can feel that authenticity.

They can, it's not some made up slogan, it's the real deal.

Makes me think of that Simon Sinek quote. People don't buy what you do, they buy why you do it.

Yes, it's about tapping into that deeper meaning. That driving force that makes you want to get up in the morning and make a difference.

Maxwell actually shares another great quote in his book about vision. It's from Theodore Hesburgh. Okay.

The former president underdamed. He said, the very essence of leadership is that you have to have vision. You can't blow an uncertain trumpet.

I love that. An uncertain trumpet. It paints such a vivid picture.

Right. It's like if you're not even sure the tune yourself, how could you expect anyone to follow your lead?

It's about having that clarity, that conviction that comes from truly knowing your purpose. That's what gives your vision the power to inspire and motivate others.

We've got vision, but then we need to bring people together to actually make that vision a reality.

Right. That's where teamwork comes in. Maxwell has a whole chapter in Developing the Leader Within You dedicated to this.

The art of teamwork. I'm all ears.

He says great leaders are like those dream team coaches. They're able to bring together a group of talented people and guide them to achieve amazing results.

I love that analogy. It's always fascinated me how a group of people can come together and accomplish so much more than any one individual could on their own.

The synergy is real.

It is.

Yeah.

But how do we create those dream teams? What qualities are we looking for?

Well, according to Maxwell, first things first, a good coach chooses their players wisely. You want people with the right skills, of course, but they also got to share the team's values.

Right.

And be committed to working together towards that common goal.

It's like building a well-oiled machine, where all the parts work together in harmony.

Exactly. It makes me think of that quote from Red Auerbach, the legendary Boston Celtics coach. He said, how you select people is more important than how you manage them.

So true. It's about getting the right people on the bus, to use that Jim Collins analogy.

Yes. And once you have the right team in place, Maxwell says you got to constantly communicate that game plan. Everyone needs to be clear on the goals, the strategy, how their role contributes to the overall success.

Communication is key. I think that's true in any relationship, but especially when you're trying to lead a team effectively.

It's all about making sure everyone's on the same page and working towards that shared vision.

And a good coach doesn't just bark orders. They foster that team spirit.

Oh, absolutely. They create an environment of trust, respect, camaraderie. Everyone feels valued, supported.

They celebrate successes together, learn from failures together, and support each other through the tough times.

That sense of belonging is so powerful, it can really make or break a team.

For sure. And then there's skills development. A good coach invests in their team, provides opportunities for growth, training, mentorship, so everyone can continuously improve and contribute their best.

It's like you're showing your team that you believe in them. You're investing in their future.

Exactly. And a good coach also knows that problems are inevitable. Things will go wrong, challenges will pop up, but it's how you respond to those setbacks that really defines your leadership.

It's about being proactive, having a plan, being resilient, and showing your team that you can handle the pressure.

Right. You're leading by example. And finally, a good dream team coach provides the support their team needs to succeed.

Sport in all forms, right? Resources, tools, recognition.

All of it. It's about creating an environment where people feel empowered to take risks, make mistakes, and learn from them.

A safe space to grow and experiment.

Exactly. And Maxwell believes that when you embody all these qualities, when you choose players well, communicate clearly, foster team spirit, develop skills, prepare for problems, and provide support, it creates a ripple effect throughout the team, and you end up with this amazing culture of excellence, collaboration, and shared success.

It's like a recipe for success.

It is.

This has been such an inspiring deep dive into John C. Maxwell's work.

I know, right?

I feel like we've just scratched the surface, though. There's so much wisdom packed into these books.

There really is. It's like a master class in leadership.

But even in this short exploration, I've gained so much insight into what it means to be a truly effective leader. It's clear that leadership, it's not just about having a title or being in charge. It's about influencing, inspiring, and empowering others to reach their full potential.

The best part is leadership is a skill that can be developed. No matter where you are in your journey, there's always room to grow and improve.

Absolutely. To all of our listeners out there, I want to leave you with this question. What's one small step you can take today to unlock your own leadership potential?

Maybe it's reading one of Maxwell's books or reaching out to a mentor.

Or even just practicing one of the principles we talked about today.

Exactly. Because remember, leadership is not a destination, it's a journey.

We're all in this together.

Thanks for joining us on this deep dive everyone. Until next time, keep learning, keep growing, and keep leading.

We hope you're leaving with fresh insights and a spark of inspiration. Remember to subscribe, leave a review, and check back for more episodes as we dive into new worlds of thought, one book at a time. Until then, keep your mind set in stone and your curiosity open.

This has been a Big L Riz Media Podcast, where big ideas meet lasting impressions.